Any piece of his you don't like?
I already typed a lengthy message at the temporary board and I'm not about to do it again. I think the question is pretty straightforward. Thanks for any responses.
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The "choral fantasy" is obviously a
compostion which is not up to Beethoven´s normal standard. The music takes far too long before it becomes interesting.
I feel that the 1. movement of the
violin concerto is a bit too long, especially the ending.
The 2. movement of the triple concerto
is not so much to be proud about.
4. movement of Opus 18 nr 6. (Rod I give you a answear on the new page soon)
I have some problems with his two last cello sonatas (but here I should do more listening)
His opera "Fidelio". The 2. act is great -and this saves the opera. But 1. act has no forward drive and Beethoven writing for Leonore is too high someplaces (or impossible to sing)
Ready to be attacked.
[This message has been edited by Joern Halvorsen (edited 02-09-2002).] -
Perhaps it is being played too slowly when you have heard it. I like it slow myself, but a lot of people feel it drags if the tempo is not fast enough.Originally posted by Joern Halvorsen:
I feel that the 1. movement of the
violin concerto is a bit too long, especially the ending.
I actually like Act 1 better!His opera "Fidelio". The 2. act is great -and this saves the opera. But 1. act has no forward drive and Beethoven writes far too high for Leonore voice.Comment
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It's the best movement of that work - a gem!Originally posted by Joern Halvorsen:
The 2. movement of the triple concerto
is not so much to be proud about.
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'Man know thyself''Man know thyself'Comment
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In my opinion Act 2 is better because the story becomes more dramatic, and this is moreOriginally posted by Chris:
I actually like Act 1 better!
suitable for Beethovens way of composing.
However in general this opera is not a master
piece, or what do you think Chris?
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It's not a masterpiece, its beyond a masterpiece, its beyond opera! Concerning works such as the Erioca and the Violin concerto the first movements are usually played too slow. With the Concerto conductors take the terms 'allegro moderato' or 'allegro ma non troppo' far too literally than it should be with Beethoven, but get the recording by Frans Bruggen on Phillips and you'll forget any thought about this piece being lame. With the Eroica the first movment is supposed to be con brio, but how often do we hear this? B's metronome mark makes things quite clear. In this case I recommend Savall's recording on Astree. Never judge a Beethoven piece by a recording, as Beethoven is the least understood and worst performed of all the well known composers.Originally posted by Joern Halvorsen:
In my opinion Act 2 is better because the story becomes more dramatic, and this is more
suitable for Beethovens way of composing.
However in general this opera is not a master
piece, or what do you think Chris?
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"If I were but of noble birth..." - Rod CorkinComment
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Not only do I think it is great, but I owe my very love of opera to it. Before I heard this work, I hated opera. Now, I loved classical music - symphonies, concertos, chamber music, but I detested opera. I found it boring and just plain awful. When hearing a music professor (a doctor of vocal music no less) say Fidelio was crap, I just overlooked it entirely. And this guy loved Beethoven, too! He was always raving about the 3rd symphony.Originally posted by Joern Halvorsen:
In my opinion Act 2 is better because the story becomes more dramatic, and this is more
suitable for Beethovens way of composing.
However in general this opera is not a master
piece, or what do you think Chris?
But then I decided to just buy it and listen to it for pretty much no reason. I guess I just wanted something new by Beethoven to listen to. And by the end of the recording, I was hooked. I eventually came to understand that it was not opera I hated, but Romantic opera (Verdi, Wagner, etc.) that I hated. I started listening to more Classical opera and became quite a fan of it. I especially love Mozart's fabulous operas. But to this day Fidelio remains my favorite. As with so much of Beethoven's music, I wish I could hear it for the first time all over again.
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After Fidelio I only have time for Handel operas. By coincidence (I listen to my CD collection in strict rotation!) I have H's Rinaldo on my walkman as I type. H produces arias of the utmost poise and beauty by the dozen.Originally posted by Chris:
I especially love Mozart's fabulous operas. But to this day Fidelio remains my favorite. As with so much of Beethoven's music, I wish I could hear it for the first time all over again.
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"If I were but of noble birth..." - Rod CorkinComment
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I especially love Mozart's fabulous operas. But to this day Fidelio remains my favorite.
By experience with Fidelio is from two performances; the second time I went because
I wanted to find out whether my first impression was correct. But I did not change my opinion much (which is usually the case if I dislike anything by Beethoven). Since I today do not owe any recording it is difficult to go into any detail (plan to pick up the Naxos recording soon) but I give two examples.
The Leonore III is not a good overture for the opera. It is so much tention in this music that it create the expectation that we are going to witness a greek drama. This is not the case even though I like the story
The opening aria for me is Beethoven´s attempt to write in the style of Mozart, but it feels like a shadow of his style (less elegant, clumsy in a way). This aria at least does not outperform Mozart way of writing!
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OK... But Leonore III is not the overture to Fidelio.Originally posted by Joern Halvorsen:
The Leonore III is not a good overture for the opera. It is so much tention in this music that it create the expectation that we are going to witness a greek drama. This is not the case even though I like the story.
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If you heard this at the opening of the performance you were not listening to Fidelio but in fact the 1806 version of Leonore!!! This does get performed on occasion these days. Fidelio is a much different work from this.Originally posted by Joern Halvorsen:
...The Leonore III is not a good overture for the opera. It is so much tention in this music that it create the expectation that we are going to witness a greek drama. This is not the case even though I like the story
The opening duet is often underplayed, in an attempt perhaps to make it elegant! It should be a spritely piece, then it's quality is revealed. I would say it out performs any of Mozart, but then Fidelio's main competition does not come from Mozart (whose efforts are not in Fidelio's class) but from Handel's 'Theodora' (which certainly is in F's class) - a rescue story with a little cross dressing also! Here the hero and heroine end up being executed however. Most of it is in the minor key apart from the occasional Roman orgy! There is a video production at the Glyndbourne Festival Opera that is miraculous. This is Handel's best work, an opera/oratorio.Originally posted by Joern Halvorsen:
The opening aria for me is Beethoven´s attempt to write in the style of Mozart, but it feels like a shadow of his style (less elegant, clumsy in a way). This aria at least does not outperform Mozart way of writing!
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"If I were but of noble birth..." - Rod Corkin
[This message has been edited by Rod (edited 02-13-2002).]Comment
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