Howard Goodall's "Story of Music"

[Peter]

His previous programme (which dealt with the Baroque period) was much better (at least to my unprofessional ears). He dealt with Bach, Handel, Vivaldi et al. in a sensible fashion. However, he seems to have gone adrift in the Classical/Romantic era.

He praised Mozart for keeping his nasty personal feelings under check and implicitly castigated Beethoven for having the temerity to reveal his inner turmoil. No mention at all was made of Beethoven's stupendous compositional technique - without which all the emotional outpourings would be mere noise.

He did praise the funeral march of the "Eroica", but the first movement was described as "clever-clogs" !! Well, it is clever, but much more than that - in fact the whole symphony was the greatest single step forward in the history of music. (But that's only my opinion - and that of millions of music lovers.)

He could not ignore Beethoven's progress and stature but one got the impression that B was second-rate by Mozartian and Schubertian standards.

I did warn yous!

Thanks for that Michael and from your review I'm glad I turned off when I did! I wonder what anyone would actually have learnt about these composers, especially if they were coming to it with little knowledge - we learnt more about Goodall and this is the trouble with most programmes today, they are more about the presenter than the subject - gone are the Attenboroughs and the Patrick Moores.

[Michael]

His previous programme (which dealt with the Baroque period) was much better (at least to my unprofessional ears). He dealt with Bach, Handel, Vivaldi et al. in a sensible fashion. However, he seems to have gone adrift in the Classical/Romantic era.

He praised Mozart for keeping his nasty personal feelings under check and implicitly castigated Beethoven for having the temerity to reveal his inner turmoil. No mention at all was made of Beethoven's stupendous compositional technique - without which all the emotional outpourings would be mere noise.

He did praise the funeral march of the "Eroica", but the first movement was described as "clever-clogs" !! Well, it is clever, but much more than that - in fact the whole symphony was the greatest single step forward in the history of music. (But that's only my opinion - and that of millions of music lovers.)

He could not ignore Beethoven's progress and stature but one got the impression that B was second-rate by Mozartian and Schubertian standards.

I did warn yous!

[Peter]

Well I bit the bullet and watched last night and I have to say I wasn't impressed, in fact I couldn't cope with more than 20 minutes so I never even made it to Beethoven! It seemed to me to be simplistic, full of huge generalisations and he would pick an example to back up a point, when dozens of others could have been used to contradict it. Harmony for example in the classical era we were told was basically three chords and Gluck's 'dance of the blessed spirits' was the example here. How then would he analyse Mozart's C minor fantasy that plunges in it's first page through the remotest of keys? Mozart had an amazing harmonic palette that even suggests atonality in the development of symphony no.40 1st movt. Then he talked about the era not reflecting the events of the day and used the French revolution and one of Haydn's London symphonies to back this argument up - what about Mozart and 'The Marriage of Figaro'? Maybe it improved later on but from what I've seen I've decided against my original post and won't be looking for the dvd.

[Peter]

I must confess I thoroughly enjoyed Goodalls' tour of the Baroque era. I must admire him for his "keyboard" approach. He really knows his stuff.
However, I will be very interested in how he approaches our hero next week.
He doesn't "get" Beethoven and has fully admitted it.
Will he pay lip service or will he give his honest opinion?
Will the awareness that countless millions of musicians and laymen worship Ludwig Van make him wary? Or will he stick to his guns?
Next week will tell.

In this age of sexual equality, I apologise for the word "laymen" but I'm afraid "laywomen" doesn't help!

I think I'll wait for the dvd - can't get into the mood for it at the moment but I know he is a Goodall presenter! Much preferable to Hazlewood who I find irritating.

[Michael]

I must confess I thoroughly enjoyed Goodalls' tour of the Baroque era. I must admire him for his "keyboard" approach. He really knows his stuff.
However, I will be very interested in how he approaches our hero next week.
He doesn't "get" Beethoven and has fully admitted it.
Will he pay lip service or will he give his honest opinion?
Will the awareness that countless millions of musicians and laymen worship Ludwig Van make him wary? Or will he stick to his guns?
Next week will tell.

In this age of sexual equality, I apologise for the word "laymen" but I'm afraid "laywomen" doesn't help!

[Quijote]

[...] Incidentally, Goodall wrote the theme music for "Blackadder" and "Mr Bean".

Funny you mention Mr Bean:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/2013...-london-review

[Quijote]

No, that was Charles Hazelwood, another BBC musician-cum-presenter. His favourite composer is Mozart but he did a fine job on the Beethoven series. Hazelwood is a conductor of more "serious" music while Goodall is more in the "light" vein. (I hate those distinctions but it's the quickest way to get the point across.)
Incidentally, Goodall wrote the theme music for "Blackadder" and "Mr Bean".

Ah, right you are!

[Michael]

Unfortunately, I can't get to see these programmes, but wasn't Goodall the guy who did the Genius of Beethoven 3-part series on the BBC? He didn't strike me as particularly 'anti Beethoven' there. (I saw those on YouTube for the first time a couple of months ago.)

No, that was Charles Hazelwood, another BBC musician-cum-presenter. His favourite composer is Mozart but he did a fine job on the Beethoven series. Hazelwood is a conductor of more "serious" music while Goodall is more in the "light" vein. (I hate those distinctions but it's the quickest way to get the point across.)
Incidentally, Goodall wrote the theme music for "Blackadder" and "Mr Bean".

[Quijote]

Unfortunately, I can't get to see these programmes, but wasn't Goodall the guy who did the Genius of Beethoven 3-part series on the BBC? He didn't strike me as particularly 'anti Beethoven' there. (I saw those on YouTube for the first time a couple of months ago.)

[Michael]

I actually found the first episode very interesting. He went from the earliest times up to Montiverdi and he explained a lot of technical stuff by means of a keyboard (no doubt rudimentary for many on this forum).

Early harmony such as organum was demonstrated by a fine group of singers and the whole thing was a pleasant surprise. I can almost forgive him for his deafness regarding Beethoven - but, then again, I am pre-judging because he hasn't reached him yet.

[Peter]

I was glancing through Howard Goodall's book (linked to the above-mentioned BBC series) and found his Beethoven analysis annoying - as I knew I would. This link tells it all:

http://www.classicfm.com/composers/b...all-beethoven/

Well, we can't all be Ludwig fans, I suppose. I've just been watching the start of his series and it looks good. At least he isn't swanning around Vienna or Paris or whatever while talking about music.

Well I admire his honesty but wonder if his reasoning is simply conditioned by our knowledge of Beethoven's working methods? Had we no sketchbooks perhaps Goodall would see (hear) things differently? Actually I haven't watched this series - are we really going to learn anything new, will there be a load of new facts or is it simply another rehash?

[Michael]

I was glancing through Howard Goodall's book (linked to the above-mentioned BBC series) and found his Beethoven analysis annoying - as I knew I would. This link tells it all:

http://www.classicfm.com/composers/b...all-beethoven/

Well, we can't all be Ludwig fans, I suppose. I've just been watching the start of his series and it looks good. At least he isn't swanning around Vienna or Paris or whatever while talking about music.

[Megan]

The "listen again" service is brilliant for radio, Megan, but any television programmes on the BBC "watch again" are blocked for anybody outside the UK which means me. However, I can watch and record it off Sky. If you keep an eye out after Jan 25th (which is my birthday, by the way) you will be able to see Goodall's programme on your computer.





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Thanks Michael, I'll look forward to watching the programme.

[Michael]

Thanks Michael, I have made a note, though don't have a telly I hope that there will be a 'listen again' feature on the internet.

The "listen again" service is brilliant for radio, Megan, but any television programmes on the BBC "watch again" are blocked for anybody outside the UK which means me. However, I can watch and record it off Sky. If you keep an eye out after Jan 25th (which is my birthday, by the way) you will be able to see Goodall's programme on your computer.





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[Michael]

Don't blame you with the endless tripe that's on - well Goodall usually does a good programme and I can just about forgive his Beethovenaphobia providing he doesn't harp on about it!

I'm sure he will pay the proper lip service to our patron.