Bach and the piano.

[Enrique]

I think the piano is a wonderful instrument to play Bach, but can't bear the use of the dynamics most of pianists do. They make use of the full resources in dynamics the piano is capable of, as this guilty example shows:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...kgfaR4Dms&NR=1

I assure you guys I'm no Bach purist. Its just a matter of fact. I don't like it this way. But maybe others do. What do you think? Or feel, I should say, for it's not the mind but the heart who must speak here.

Note: this does not mean the mind has nothing to do when listening to music. Particularly in the case of Bach, it reaches the heart by way of the mind. There is a whole area in the brain cortex dedicated to the processing of music, call it device, and this device has to be particularly structured in order to appreciate poliphonic music.

[Peter]

I don't think Bach's keybaord music should be devoid of dynamics, but of course they shouldn't be too exaggerated.

[Sorrano]

I don't think Bach's keybaord music should be devoid of dynamics, but of course they shouldn't be too exaggerated.

It is difficult to apply dynamics in a traditional sense when played with harpsichord or organ.

[Enrique]

In the last ten years of the Master's life, was the piano at his home upright or grand? I'll guess it was a grand. And was it Viennese or English? [I meant the Master = Beethoven]

EDIT: (a) How are those signs indicating crescendo (resp. diminuendo) drawn above a group of notes called? (b) Were there harpsichords capable of producing sound at two different loudnesses? May be some with two keyboards?

[Peter]

It is difficult to apply dynamics in a traditional sense when played with harpsichord or organ.

Of course, but Enrique's talking about the piano I think. Don't forget that Bach played the 48 on the Clavier which did allow for dynamic shading. Also when playing the fugues it is essential that different tone levels are employed in order to discern the different parts clearly.

[Peter]

In the last ten years of the Master's life, was the piano at his home upright or grand? I'll guess it was a grand. And was it Viennese or English? [I meant the Master = Beethoven]

EDIT: (a) How are those signs indicating crescendo (resp. diminuendo) drawn above a group of notes called? (b) Were there harpsichords capable of producing sound at two different loudnesses? May be some with two keyboards?

Beethoven only ever owned grand pianos - there was in fact no such thing as an upright piano which developed later in the 19th century. There was however the square piano (which is actually rectangular!) but I'm not aware Beethoven owned one. Beethoven had an English (Broadwood) and a Viennese (Graf) piano at the time of his death, however looking through Thayer's inventory of Beethoven's estate I can only find the Broadwood listed. He also possessed a complete string quartet - 2 violins, viola and 'cello that had been presented as a gift - amongst them an Amati violin that would be worth a fortune today!

The general term for cresc. forte, piano etc is dynamics - string players jokingly refer to the crescendo signs as 'hairpins'!

[Sorrano]

I do recall seeing pictures of upright grands; do you know when these were around? I thought they might have been around in Beethoven's time.

[Peter]

I do recall seeing pictures of upright grands; do you know when these were around? I thought they might have been around in Beethoven's time.

I think the upright grands you are referring to were known as 'Giraffes' and stood 7' - it had first been tried with little success as early as 1730 but the origins go back even further to 1480 when the harpsichord was up-ended and renamed Clavicytherium. The Giraffe pianos because of their size and expense were only really available to a minority and not that practical, so a process of shrinkage began. As early as 1802 Thomas Loud was experimenting with the upright piano but it was really with Robert Wornum's diagonally strung 1813 'cottage' piano standing less than 4' that the upright arrived. However it wasn't until the mid 19th century that it replaced the Square piano as an instrument of popular choice.