Palestrina!

[gprengel]

In the last weeks I was introduced to an altogether new dimension of music to me. So far music had it's beginning for me with Handel and Bach and now somebody gave me this "Missa Papae Marcelli" from Palestrina from around 1560!

http://www.amazon.com/Allegri-Misere...e=UTF8&s=music

I think I never heard such transcendent and heavenly music as this - both regarding the composition and the interpretation, especially the Sanctus and Agnus Dei. Only Beethoven's "Incarnatus est" from op. 123 and the slow movement from op. 132 comes close to that. Again and again I listen to it now with my MP3 player.

Does anybody know whether Beethoven knew Palestrina? Didn't he study the old masters when composing the Missa solemnis?

Gerd

[Peter]

Yes he went even further back than Palestrina to Gregorian chant. In 1818 he wrote 'In order to write true church music go through all the plainchants of the monks.' He regarded Palestrina as the best composer of church music partly because his music was a cappella 'the only true church style'.

The Missa Papae Marcelli is a beautiful work and should be in the collection of every music lover!

[Joy]

Absolutely! Palestrina's music is beautiful and his compositions showed a smooth style.

[Megan]

gprengel,
Palestrina was part of the counter reformation which included other masters such as Tallis, Byrd . You might also like to listen Thomas Tallis, heavenly Spem in alium and also a favourite of mine is Monteverdi , Vespers of the Blessed Virgin Mary and other such works.
Brilliant !

[Chris]

I think it is a shame Palestrina is not used by more church choirs today - it is very possible for a group of dedicated amatures to sing some of these works.

[Megan]

I think it is a shame Palestrina is not used by more church choirs today - it is very possible for a group of dedicated amatures to sing some of these works.

Chris,
Palestrina is sung in the Catholic Church , particularly Missa Papae Marcelli.
I have heard this sung at Latin Mass. It is the most ravishing and sublime music written .

[Sorrano]

Chris,
Palestrina is sung in the Catholic Church , particularly Missa Papae Marcelli.
I have heard this sung at Latin Mass. It is the most ravishing and sublime music written .

I can only imagine this being sung in a cathedral! I do not listen enough to Palestrina!

[Chris]

Chris,
Palestrina is sung in the Catholic Church , particularly Missa Papae Marcelli.
I have heard this sung at Latin Mass. It is the most ravishing and sublime music written .

Yes, I know, but my point is that it is not used enough. No Catholic church I have ever actually been to has used any Gregorian Chant or Sacred Polyphony of any kind. Instead, we get folk songs from the 60's. I mean...come on.

[Joy]

The Catholic Church I go to is a more traditional one as they play a lot of Bach, Baroque and Classical music, and some Palestrina as well especially at the Latin Masses which Megan mentioned.

[jman]

Some rennaisance music is ignored way too much. Palestrina is great. I also love the masses of the aforementioned Byrd. Some other greats that I like-Gesualdo (certainly not church music though ), Ockeghem (love the bass) and aren't Thomas Morely's madrigals so fun?

[Peter]

Some rennaisance music is ignored way too much. Palestrina is great. I also love the masses of the aforementioned Byrd. Some other greats that I like-Gesualdo (certainly not church music though ), Ockeghem (love the bass) and aren't Thomas Morely's madrigals so fun?

I agree and it is a shame that such a wealth of great music is largely ignored. It is an area of great interest to me and I certainly intend exploring it a great deal more. Wandering round Lincoln cathedral (UK) I must have been guided to a little plaque on the wall commemorating William Byrd's time as organist there - a pleasant surprise. In the Uk it seems to me we do not celebrate at all the period in music when we could compete with the rest of Europe - the 16th century, and great names such as Byrd and Morley are hardly household!

[Megan]

Yes, I know, but my point is that it is not used enough. No Catholic church I have ever actually been to has used any Gregorian Chant or Sacred Polyphony of any kind. Instead, we get folk songs from the 60's. I mean...come on.

*

Perhaps you church is more charismatic Chris , guitar twangers and all that.
Dare I mention Vatican ll has a lot to answer for ? It is just so difficult please everyone's taste. I prefer the more traditional music in church.

[Megan]

The Catholic Church I go to is a more traditional one as they play a lot of Bach, Baroque and Classical music, and some Palestrina as well especially at the Latin Masses which Megan mentioned.

That sounds gorgeous Joy, you will have to take Chris along to your church sometimes.

[Chris]

*

Perhaps you church is more charismatic Chris , guitar twangers and all that.
Dare I mention Vatican ll has a lot to answer for ? It is just so difficult please everyone's taste. I prefer the more traditional music in church.

Not really. Usually I play the piano for one or two of the weekend Masses, and for my part at least, the music is played appropriately. We have some very good singers too. It's just that the music selection itself is not good. Unfortunately we don't have an organ, but our choir is capable of doing a lot of beautiful a capella music. Instead we do a lot of those Marty Haugen/David Haas attrocities. Sometimes it is truly embarassing for me to sit up there and play them, or even just to sit with the congregation and sing them. It's such a waste of talent - we have a lot of gifted musicians who give their time, and then we give this nonsense to sing.

Don't get me wrong, though - our music is not nearly as bad as in many other places. Usually our Christmas and Easter Masses are very good, with a nice selection of music. I just think it's a shame that we never use Gregorian Chant or Sacred Polyphony AT ALL.

Well, we are currently looking for a new director of music, so perhaps we will see some changes to that effect soon.

[Joy]

That sounds gorgeous Joy, you will have to take Chris along to your church sometimes.

It is very nice. I, too, enjoy the more traditional Church music. Just call me old fashioned.