Brahms - a few interesting facts

[King Stephen]

I read that Brahms was extremely generous to students of music, and he certainly vaulted Dvorak into the limelight. His love and affection for the Schumann children shows a kinder, gentler Johannes. His loneliness,I believe,led to his caustic manners from time to time.

[Sorrano]

Thanks, Chaszz, for that info! I was just thinking about Brahms while listening to the Schumann (in the listening thread). That helps give me a better perspective of the man and composer. Being short myself, I don't mind a bit that some of the greatest were short.

[Joy]

Originally posted by Chaszz:
I just finished reading a biography of Brahms. I had not realized he was short. So the four greatest 19th centruy composers were all short, at five feet tall or less -- Beethoven, Schubert, Brahms and Wagner.

He never married although he had several love involvements. Like Beethoven, he sometimes complained of loneliness and the lack of a loving helpmate. Also like Beethoven, he seems to have been afraid to commit when in young and middle age opportunity did present itself. Perhaps in Brahms' case his lifelong ambivalence to women had much to do with his being forced as an eleven-year old to play piano in waterfront bars and brothels to help support his desperately poor family. The ladies of the night made sport of him, coddled and teased him at the confusing age of puberty. He worked there for several years, and later in life spoke of it as the most difficult ordeal he ever had. It may have been responsible not only for his later troubles in love, but also for his violent temper.

[This message has been edited by Chaszz (edited 07-03-2005).]

Very interesting biography of the man, Chaszz. Not to be picky but wasn't Beethoven 5' 4" tall? On the short side to be sure but in those days maybe that was average height?

Anyway, reading about the brothels at his young age being a part of all that goings on would have probably confused anyone!


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'Truth and beauty joined'

[Chaszz]

I just finished reading a biography of Brahms. I had not realized he was short. So the four greatest 19th centruy composers were all short, at five feet tall or less -- Beethoven, Schubert, Brahms and Wagner.

Another fact I had not known was that Brahms fired the first cannonball in his famous feud with Wagner -- in 1860 he published a manifesto in the newspaper attacking Liszt, Wagner and the "new" school of music, ending with the words that their theories were "contrary to the innermost spirit of music, strongly to be condemned and deplored."

Brahms was often sarcastic and sometimes much worse, having a terrible temper. At one gathering of his friends he attacked everyone in turn, then got up to leave with the words, "If there is anyone here I have not insulted, I beg your pardon." He lost a number of good friends this way.

He later valued Wagner's work, saying that those who did not like his rival's music did not understand it. When he had news of Wagner's death in 1873 Brahms was rehearsing a chorus. He closed his score and said "We sing no more today. A master has died."

He never married although he had several love involvements. Like Beethoven, he sometimes complained of loneliness and the lack of a loving helpmate. Also like Beethoven, he seems to have been afraid to commit when in young and middle age opportunity did present itself. Perhaps in Brahms' case his lifelong ambivalence to women had much to do with his being forced as an eleven-year old to play piano in waterfront bars and brothels to help support his desperately poor family. The ladies of the night made sport of him, coddled and teased him at the confusing age of puberty. He worked there for several years, and later in life spoke of it as the most difficult ordeal he ever had. It may have been responsible not only for his later troubles in love, but also for his violent temper.

[This message has been edited by Chaszz (edited 07-03-2005).]