Originally posted by AeolianHarp
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The difference lies in the suffering caused. I would have thought that was obvious.
That is what it boils down to isn't it? Under no circumstances do people agree it is ok to kill each other for food, but they see animals as lesser beings for their plates. Thus human arrogance- a baby rabbit is seen as property in a way a human baby isn't. Yet both feel pain equally. Stab a rabbit with a fork, stab a human baby, both will feel pain.
Oh really?!!! I know one true story in which a dog sat on a railway line to stop a woman he'd never met before from committing suicide by jumping onto the railway line. He sat there looking at his "owner" who was calling and calling him (he had never ran way like that before, and sat there calmly looking at her). Would you do that for some random woman you'd never met???
How did Rex the dog know that??? His senses knew it.
Animals rescue each other from dangers, feed each other, and save humans from drowning and all sorts.
How did Rex the dog know that??? His senses knew it.
Animals rescue each other from dangers, feed each other, and save humans from drowning and all sorts.
Again you judge them by human standards, which doesn't work. I say they are capable of doing "good" and capable of doing "bad." They can show love, they can show hate. But humans show the most extremes of hate than animals do.
If humans are rational then I am the Wizard of Oz! What is rational about a species that has constantly waged war on themselves since they evolved???
Socrates is a man.
Therefore, Socrates is mortal.
Animals may know Socrates. They may recognize how he looks, how he sounds, and how he smells. They may form a mental picture of him when they smell something of his, even when he is not present. But they cannot understand the abstract concept man. And they cannot understand the abstract concept mortal. They can only sense and imagine specific instances of these things. They cannot understand the concepts, and they cannot reason from one to another. That is what makes human beings rational and animals non-rational. In the same way that animals posses faculties that plants do not (such as imagination), human beings posses rational faculties that other animals do not.
Language is not all that- it is only our form of communication. Animals have their own forms of communication. Ours might be more complex, but it allows for more devious and nasty ways to abuse each other.
Dolphins and whales have a very complex system of communication, some of it is even like hieroglyphs and they can communicate far more than we can at a much faster rate- something like 15 times more information a minute. They see sound in ways we cannot.
Dolphins and whales have a very complex system of communication, some of it is even like hieroglyphs and they can communicate far more than we can at a much faster rate- something like 15 times more information a minute. They see sound in ways we cannot.
In this clip, Michael responds to a question about his mother with this description of that event — a memory that he conveyed several times, before his own passing in 2000.
MIT linguist Noam Chomsky:
http://www.chomsky.info/interviews/2007----.htm
Cognitive scientist Steven Pinker:
http://www.math.chalmers.se/~ulfp/Review/pinker.pdf
The way things are going, we will keep creating more big toys, and destroy ourselves with it in our petty squabbles about whose god is better than another's.
Animals at least, are above such disgusting nonsense.
Animals at least, are above such disgusting nonsense.
Let me reiterate that I am not saying that animals are machines, in a Cartesian sense. On the contrary, sensation and imagination are not mechanistic processes. Nor am I saying that we are free to abuse animals in any way we like. I am only examining what animals are and what they are not.




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