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Chris
03-18-2001, 07:05 PM
Well, I went to another concert last night (Baltimore Symphony Orchestra). Beethoven's 4th Symphony was the main attraction, and boy, was it great. Tempos were right on, no mistakes, and I had great seats! There was also Prokofiev's Piano Concerto No. 2. It was well played, but I really don't like that piece too much. The only other piece was an original composition that was commissioned by the BSO and had its first performance on Friday, I think. It SUCKED. It was, well, Modern, and not in a good way (if there is a good way).

A funny thing, though. When that commissioned piece was over, I turned to my mother (sitting beside me) and said, "Boy was that a piece of crap!" Then the guy that was sitting directly in front of me stood up, walked up to the stage, and started talking about what it was like to compose that piece. So...yeah http://www.gyrix.com/~cgraye/ubb/smile.gif

Rod
03-18-2001, 07:12 PM
Originally posted by Chris:

A funny thing, though. When that commissioned piece was over, I turned to my mother (sitting beside me) and said, "Boy was that a piece of crap!" Then the guy that was sitting directly in front of me stood up, walked up to the stage, and started talking about what it was like to compose that piece. So...yeah http://www.gyrix.com/~cgraye/ubb/smile.gif

Seems like your mother is a woman of taste, though I should perhaps reserve judgement until you tell us what your mother thought of the Beethoven!


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"If I were but of noble birth..." - Rod Corkin

Peter
03-18-2001, 09:29 PM
Originally posted by Chris:
The only other piece was an original composition that was commissioned by the BSO and had its first performance on Friday, I think. It SUCKED. It was, well, Modern, and not in a good way (if there is a good way).



Once upon a time many moons ago I was in my local youth orchestra and after B's Emperor concerto with John Lill we played a piece titled 'At Bignor Hill' by someone I have never heard of since (anyone else?) called Robert Walker (I have his autograph!!) - it was a cacophony and an embarrassment as my parents and grandparents (not particular c.m fans anyway) were in the audience !
This man continued to haunt us as he toured with us in Portugal and wrecked many an otherwise succesful concert with his damn Bignor Hill!

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'Man know thyself'

PDG
03-19-2001, 12:38 AM
I bet Robert Walker is HUGE in Portugal.....at least bigger than you, Peter! Anyway, where the hell is Bignor Hill?

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Peter (PDG)

Chris
03-19-2001, 05:58 AM
Originally posted by Rod:
Seems like your mother is a woman of taste, though I should perhaps reserve judgement until you tell us what your mother thought of the Beethoven!


Oh, she loves Beethoven. Handel too http://www.gyrix.com/~cgraye/ubb/wink.gif My father, on the other hand, hates classical music. Being a disk jocky, he likes to rock and roll! He once interviewed Emanuel Ax on the radio, and he started off by saying, "So, Emanuel - can I "Ax" you a question?" Oh well, at least I got to see him in concert that night! (My dad waited outside!)

Suzie
03-19-2001, 06:10 AM
A funny thing, though. When that commissioned piece was over, I turned to my mother (sitting beside me) and said, "Boy was that a piece of crap!" Then the guy that was sitting directly in front of me stood up, walked up to the stage, and started talking about what it was like to compose that piece. So...yeah http://www.gyrix.com/~cgraye/ubb/smile.gif

Way to go, Chris!

I'm going to a concert Tuesday night, the highlight being B's 5th! Can't wait.



[This message has been edited by Suzie (edited 03-19-2001).]

~Leslie
03-19-2001, 08:28 AM
I was attending the Spokane symphony one night with a former client, when it came time
for a performance of a Brahms dirge. The piece was quiet, sorrowful, and full of angst.

Suddenly, a very old woman behind us started fiddling with a plastic bag she held in her lap. It was immensely distracting, and ppl started clearing their throats, squirming in their seats, and turning around and looking at her. But she was so old , (maybe even deaf?) she didn't even notice, and she went right on what she was doing.

Brahm's message was drowned out by the racket.

At the time it was highly annoying, but now
I always think of it as the "Concerto for Old Woman with Plastic Bag". ~

Peter
03-19-2001, 09:23 AM
Originally posted by PDG:
I bet Robert Walker is HUGE in Portugal.....at least bigger than you, Peter! Anyway, where the hell is Bignor Hill?



It was 20 years ago now (my God!) - next time I'm in Lisbon I'll check out the Robert Walker museum!

Bignor Hill? I'm surprised at you PDG being from this sceptered isle - it's in W.Sussex. I'm even more surpised at this link I found!! : http://www.schirmer.com/composers/walker/bio.html

No doubt I've now put this composer on the map (as severe criticism tends to do) and you'll all be rushing to your local CD stores - Mr.Walker will awake one sunny morn to find himself top of the CM charts!

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'Man know thyself'

[This message has been edited by Peter (edited 03-19-2001).]

Peter
03-19-2001, 09:37 AM
Originally posted by Suzie:

I'm going to a concert Tuesday night, the highlight being B's 5th! Can't wait.



Let us know how it went Suz! The last time I went to a performance of the 5th (Symphony and Concerto) was a couple of years ago with The Berlin Symphony Orchestra (not the Philharmonic) - the Symphony was electrifying and the tempi spot on. I forget who played the solo in the concerto as it wasn't particularly memorable.

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'Man know thyself'

Chris
03-19-2001, 08:34 PM
Actually, there were three old women behind us who would not shut up. It was lucky they went to restroom right before the Beethoven started, and were too late to be let back in. They missed the whole thing! Too bad for them, but great for the rest of us.

Joy
03-21-2001, 03:47 AM
I went to a concert last Sunday of his
1st Symphony. The performance was held in
a church. Very beautiful. It doesn't seem that they play the first or second symphonies too often so this was a real treat.
Joy

Suzie
03-21-2001, 06:51 AM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Joy:
[B]I went to a concert last Sunday of his
1st Symphony. The performance was held in
a church. Very beautiful. It doesn't seem that they play the first or second symphonies too often so this was a real treat.
Joy

The Olympia Chamber Orchestra played the 1st Symphony at their annual Beethoven Birthday Bash. I got hooked on it real bad.

Suzie
03-22-2001, 07:29 AM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Peter:
[B] Let us know how it went Suz! The last time I went to a performance of the 5th (Symphony and Concerto) was a couple of years ago with The Berlin Symphony Orchestra (not the Philharmonic) - the Symphony was electrifying and the tempi spot on. I forget who played the solo in the concerto as it wasn't particularly memorable.

I had a really good time. I was not accompanied by a squirming kid. The orchestra was comprised of high school kids and they did a great job. I was amazed and jealous. They also looked cute in their tuxes. By contrast, the flannel shirted audience looked like they just finished chopping down trees. I had to endure the brass band and some Schubert before they got to the 5th Symphony.Actually, the Schubert was not bad.

Whenever a large group of people get together and focus a mass of psychic energy on B, it's a very good thing.

BP
03-30-2001, 02:55 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Chris:
Well, I went to another concert last night (Baltimore Symphony Orchestra). Beethoven's 4th Symphony was the main attraction, and boy, was it great. Tempos were right on, no mistakes, and I had great seats! There was also Prokofiev's Piano Concerto No. 2. It was well played, but I really don't like that piece too much. The only other piece was an original composition that was commissioned by the BSO and had its first performance on Friday, I think. It SUCKED. It was, well, Modern, and not in a good way (if there is a good way).

A funny thing, though. When that commissioned piece was over, I turned to my mother (sitting beside me) and said, "Boy was that a piece of crap!" Then the guy that was sitting directly in front of me stood up, walked up to the stage, and started talking about what it was like to compose that piece. So...yeah http://www.gyrix.com/~cgraye/ubb/smile.gif[/QUO


Who's the composer, Chris? Oh, and I think I have heard the name Robert Walker before, I don't know where, though.

I don't think modern music is wholly bad, I think it just varies from composer to composer like in any other period.

BP

Chris
03-30-2001, 07:42 PM
Originally posted by BP:
Who's the composer, Chris? Oh, and I think I have heard the name Robert Walker before, I don't know where, though.

I don't think modern music is wholly bad, I think it just varies from composer to composer like in any other period.


George Tsontakis.

MCS
03-31-2001, 05:19 PM
I had the good fortune of attending a Toronto Symphony Concert yesterday. On the program was a Vioin Concerto by Joan Powers(?) and The Ninth.
After the first part of the program was endured, the music began in earnest. The first and third movements were fine, but the scherzo was electrifying! The highlight of the evening, not surprisingly, was the 4th movement, when the TSO was joined by 4 excellent soloists and the Toronto Mendelssohn Choir. The effect was something I've never gotten at home in front of the stereo, as much as I love my Claudio Abbado version. The orchestra and singers combined to produce a sound that was exuberant and an energy that was palpable. I had goosebumps!
All in all it was a memorable evening and a real morale-boost, coming at the end of 5 months of Canadian winter.

Mary

Joy
04-01-2001, 10:51 PM
I hear you, Mary. You have to experience the 9th in person, it is fantastic. I heard The Phoenix (AZ) Symphony play it a couple of years ago and they, too, had excellent soloists and a great chorus. The 2nd movement was so great that at the end of the movement the audience applauded instead of waiting for the end of the symphony all together but I guess they couldn't contain themselves, it was played so well. They're going to perform it again next concert season (2002) and I will attend. Am looking forward to it.

PDG
04-02-2001, 01:07 AM
There can surely be no doubt that live performance clouds perception. I've not heard the 9th 'live', but I accept that when I do, it will bowl me over. Just the experience of 'being there' will tip the scales in favour of the orchestra/singers. The occasion itself will always more than make up for any idiosyncratic deficiencies, which may dawn on us later. I know that Euphony & Chrisg disagree, but the dress code & demanded attention at such concerts are all part of the experience, &, I believe, this is just as it should be.

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PDG (Peter)

Mongutsi
04-02-2001, 08:42 AM
As I read these various replies (I'm new here), I find a general dislike, or at least a large feeling of dislike, for modern music. Although, as a little aside, I like Bach, Beethoven, Mozart, Chopin, Liszt, Prokofiev, Schubert, Rachmaninoff, etc. (you know what I mean) more than "modern" music, there is some good modern music out there. You just have to give it a chance. I find that enjoying "ugly" music (I know that sounds wierd) requires listening to lots and lots of "ugly" music; it's an aquired taste. Just like you have to understand a Picasso, you have to understand "ugly" music. Often, the purpose of "crazy" dissonance is to enhance the consonance that follows it.

Rod
04-02-2001, 02:09 PM
Originally posted by Mongutsi:
As I read these various replies (I'm new here), I find a general dislike, or at least a large feeling of dislike, for modern music.


That's putting things mildly in my case! It seems B has set the ultimate benchmark that will never be even matched subsequently. If it wasn't for Beethoven and also Handel, who I rate well above Bach or Mozart or the others in your list, I wouldn't even like classical music.

Originally posted by Mongutsi:

Although, as a little aside, I like Bach, Beethoven, Mozart, Chopin, Liszt, Prokofiev, Schubert, Rachmaninoff, etc. (you know what I mean) more than "modern" music, there is some good modern music out there. You just have to give it a chance. I find that enjoying "ugly" music (I know that sounds wierd) requires listening to lots and lots of "ugly" music; it's an aquired taste. Just like you have to understand a Picasso, you have to understand "ugly" music. Often, the purpose of "crazy" dissonance is to enhance the consonance that follows it.

If you lack talent, it is easier to create, and play by, your own rules rather than challenge the 'big guys' head on. Modern art as a whole suffers from this. Its purpetrators a laughing at us, and are taking money from those naiive enough to fall for it.

Regarding Picasso, I suggest a 'crazy' painting can never have as disconcerting an effect as a crazy piece of music. Paintings are relatively passive.

Now please excuse me, I must go, I'm working on my new sculpture. I'm calling it 'messy bed with shit on it and a cow's head.' I'll make a fortune with this one... when I find me a cow's head!

Rod

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"If I were but of noble birth..." - Rod Corkin

Peter
04-02-2001, 03:19 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Mongutsi:
As I read these various replies (I'm new here), I find a general dislike, or at least a large feeling of dislike, for modern music.

It depends what you mean by 'modern' - I can't think of anything or any composer that I admire post 1950, and even though I love many of the Romantic composers, I don't think anyone has equalled let alone surpassed Beethoven.


Often, the purpose of "crazy" dissonance is to enhance the consonance that follows it.

There's plenty of dissonance in Beethoven or even Bach ! Trouble with modern music is that there is no consonance, only dissonance - it just seems to be weird sound effects with little form or coherence.
I wonder what you would recommend as good modern music?

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'Man know thyself'

Claire W
04-02-2001, 04:16 PM
Originally posted by Rod:
If you lack talent, it is easier to create, and play by, your own rules rather than challenge the 'big guys' head on. Modern art as a whole suffers from this. Its purpetrators a laughing at us, and are taking money from those naiive enough to fall for it.


I must say, I completely agree! Studying composition (as I am at the moment) is to me a complete bore. I have some jumped up post-graduate making me listen to some Xenakis (?) and saying how fantastic it is, and apparent the emotion is. Why oh why oh why can I not write anything with nice motif and proper harmony?

Why has writing music become so mathematical and scientific? What happened to writing from the heart? I had to endure a 3 hour lecture on some form of serialism, and the ways in which a 'tone clock' aid composition! I was falling asleep, however not only because of the extremely boring content, but because of a heavy night out the night before and 2 hours sleep!

Having said this, I am a fan of Steve Reich. Awfully nice chap! But I think this is because I understand why he does things. People like Xenakis I do not and do not wish to understand!

MCS
04-02-2001, 05:37 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Mongutsi:
[B]As I read these various replies (I'm new here), I find a general dislike, or at least a large feeling of dislike, for modern music.

Regarding the Violin Concerto I heard at the Ninth concert, I did listen to it with an open mind. Admittedly, I know nothing about modern music, so I listened to it as I would any other kind of music. I searched in vain for a melody, nor could I find a sustained rhythm. There were interesting bits to it now and then, but nothing that seemed to hold it all together. At least with modern painting, you can still appreciate colour, form, texture, but I'm not sure what I'm supposed to be looking for in modern music.

Mary

Rod
04-03-2001, 11:00 AM
Originally posted by Claire W:
.... because of a heavy night out the night before and 2 hours sleep!


Ah yes, I remember times like these.....the good old days.

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"If I were but of noble birth..." - Rod Corkin

Claire W
04-18-2001, 02:54 AM
Originally posted by Rod:
Ah yes, I remember times like these.....the good old days.



I think I am getting too old for the heavy night, 2 hours sleep thing! Them were the days. When I were a lass..........

Peter
04-18-2001, 02:19 PM
Originally posted by Claire W:
I think I am getting too old for the heavy night, 2 hours sleep thing! Them were the days. When I were a lass..........



I'm the same - way passed it now at 38! However I have quite a few friends in their 20's who are very hard to keep up with - I'm starting to make excuses more often , such as I need to do more practice!

I've just been looking through the programme of our local arts festival (described as the best in the country!) which runs for 3 weeks in May - Its mainly full of contemporary music, Beethoven hardly features at all.

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'Man know thyself'

[This message has been edited by Peter (edited 04-18-2001).]

stout
04-19-2001, 06:50 AM
Chris!!!!

YOU live in Baltimore! (Im just assuming)I live about 45 mins from Baltimore. Are you studying at Peadbody or something!!!!

Regards Your Friend,

Stout

Chris
04-19-2001, 08:42 AM
Originally posted by stout:
Chris!!!!

YOU live in Baltimore! (Im just assuming)I live about 45 mins from Baltimore. Are you studying at Peadbody or something!!!!

Regards Your Friend,

Stout

No, I live sort of between Baltimore and Washington DC. I am not studying at Peabody (I wish I were!). When it came time to pick a career I took the computer engineering route. I still play the piano and the violin, though, and do some composing of my own in my spare time.


[This message has been edited by Chris (edited 04-19-2001).]